An anonymous commenter suggested (albeit with a question mark and a smile) that for me, EVE is about “screwing with the community.” To be honest, I find that a bizarre proposition.
I don’t see what I do as screwing with anybody. Do we talk about pirates (who are a much rougher bunch doing a lot more damage than I ever have, while laughing at the misery they strew down their own wakes) as screwing with communities? Not really, they’re just considered a force of nature to be dealt with. People don’t like them, but their play choices are recognized as legitimate.
I know EVE’s not really a role-playing game, but people adopt minor roleplaying elements to enhance their enjoyment. And that’s the story of Ironfleet in a nutshell. When we started this game, folks were doing missions at the stargates and leaving vast “canstellations” of uncollected loot. Scooping that stuff up (often under the guns of the battleships that were still finishing the mission) was the funnest thing we found to do as complete noobs flying cheap frigates. Most of us have gone on to more normal professions, but I’m the die-hard hard core. I still enjoy prospecting for loose stuff, and then securing it and removing it. Flying exotically-fitted cargo ships, finding stuff that’s not nailed down, scooping stuff up (and dealing with all the fallout and consequences and diplomatic excitement that results) is still the most fun I’ve found in this game. There’s nothing in this game that compares, for me, with the satisfaction of finding a ton of unanchored Giant Secure Cans in a belt, coming out in my fully rigged and expanded Bustard, and scooping them ten at a time, peaceful as you please. If there’s a mining operation going on around me and a bunch of screaming people discovering for the first time that you have to anchor your giant secure cans to make them “secure”, that’s a bonus. But it’s not necessary to my fun, and it’s not why I do it. I do it because I want the cans, and whatever is in them. Taking them back to my hangar is how I, personally, feel I’m “winning at EVE”.
So, that’s what Ironfleet does. We’re not in it to mess with people, it’s just that sometimes people feel messed with because what we do is relatively rare and (at least the way we do it) unexpected.
The current war, like our previous ones, is just part of the process. We see the war fee against INDY as an investment in our future. People have to understand that they can’t get away with carrying on industrial operations normally, mining dumb fat and happy in unescorted mining barges, while spinning off a few combat pilots to “punish” Ironfleet while exposing no juicy assets to conflict.
On average I was pulling one shipload of ore out of an AC-ME mining operation every other day or so. It would have been much cheaper for them to have accepted the status quo, rather than sending Chebri after me. This war is intended to help them understand that, and it should accomplish that goal even if I don’t have a single combat success.
Entries (RSS)
January 2nd, 2008 at 1:18 pm
Yeah but the issue at hand is that we didn’t send Chebri after you. In fact anyone in INDY outside of AC-ME had no idea you even exsisted at all. Chebri decided to go after you of her own accord. You decided to war dec the alliance…not the other way around.
On a plus side it is funny to read your blog. At least you are entertaining in all the non-pew-pew that’s been going on. This has been about as uneventful of a war that I’ve ever seen.
January 2nd, 2008 at 9:48 pm
Gulletsplitter, the issue with Chebri is a matter of factual dispute. You have an opinion and I have one, and we can’t either one of us prove which is true. I know for a fact, however, that AC-ME flew with her and supported her in the early days of her war, which tends to support my theory. Unless you’re one of AC-ME’s officers (I haven’t checked and you haven’t said) how would you know?
Of course I wouldn’t have war decced the alliance if I could have war-decced AC-ME alone. But that option wasn’t available.
As for the war being uneventful, how much excitement do you expect from one non-combat pilot? I’ve accomplished a substantial portion of my war aims without firing a shot. Not all wars are about the big kaboom, you know. I’d say I’ve inflicted about the same amount of pain on AC-ME (some minor inconvenience, some minor rearrangement of activities and locations) that Chebri’s inflicted on me. That was my goal, and it’s working.
Hell, one member of INDY was complaining about jumping 26 jumps to get to the war — that’s more inconvenience than I’ve suffered.
January 3rd, 2008 at 12:27 pm
Oh I’m not saying that some of AC-ME has not had some hand in the pot. I’m saying it was definitely a surprise to the rest of the alliance that you war dec’ed us. Your reasons for dec’ing definitely have some validity in that there was a contigent of AC-ME that did not appreciate you stealing from them. But then your style of play probably leads to a good many “short” wars because of people not enjoying your style of play. I’m sure you understand the ramifications of your actions…I believe that is some of the enjoyment you get from the game. Sometimes it is fun to tweak people just for the sake of it. You seem to enjoy it more then others.
And oh yeah…I was the one complaining about the 26 jumps…or at least one of them. I’m not an AC-ME officer…I am an alliance officer though.
January 3rd, 2008 at 7:19 pm
“On average I was pulling one shipload of ore out of an AC-ME mining operation every other day or so. It would have been much cheaper for them to have accepted the status quo, rather than sending Chebri after me. ”
No one sent me after you. It was my own decision. Another lie by Marlenus. Am I not being specific enough?
libel
An untruthful statement about a person, published in writing or through broadcast media, that injures the person’s reputation or standing in the community. Because libel is a tort (a civil wrong), the injured person can bring a lawsuit against the person who made the false statement. Libel is a form of defamation , as is slander (an untruthful statement that is spoken, but not published in writing or broadcast through the media).
January 3rd, 2008 at 7:50 pm
My assertion that AC-ME sent you after me is in the nature of an intelligence estimate. An inference, if you will, from all the available facts, including your own statements.
As such, it could indeed be wrong. I’d have no way of knowing for sure, would I? Certainly, I don’t have any reason to believe you.
But “wrong” is not the same as “a lie.” Again, I don’t think you know what that word means.
So, no, you’re not being specific enough. You still haven’t identified a lie. You haven’t even manage to identify a fact that I got wrong. My impression is that you’re just shouting “lies lies lies” because you don’t have any arguments.
January 3rd, 2008 at 8:24 pm
Well I can flat out say that AC-ME did not send Chebri after you. She did so of her own accord and then some of the other AC-ME’s hardily endorsed her action. So your inference is wrong that it was an AC-ME guided war.
That being said to continue to portray this war as AC-ME induced would be a lie.
Granted that I am not a wholly neutral third party in this and you can take that however you like. I’m basing the bulk of this on the alliance channel as people have trickled back in from the holidays there has been a lot of “Chebri did what?” going on. And the fact that Cordus and Kelserat have told me that they didn’t put her up to it. They having come off of one war prior to joining the alliance where not looking immediately for another. Not exactly the best way to impress your new friends neh?
The bulk of the alliance views your actions towards it as basically a current inability of either you or Chebri to get at each other for satisfaction/gloating. So for lack of a target you have decided to go after AC-ME who has some membership that is definitely not neutral. Plus the attention you seem to be seeking….
Having not spoken directly to Chebri about this…I think she just wants her ore back. Though I’m unclear if you actually got her ore or somebody in AC-ME’s ore.
January 3rd, 2008 at 10:35 pm
Gulletsplitter, what we’ve got here is a situation where there’s an information theory problem. As an interested party, you have no particular motive toward accuracy, but I also have no strong reason to disbelieve you. The trouble is, you don’t have all the information, since you’re not in AC-ME.
Cordus has told me, and I believe him, that “I did not ask Chebri and Genghis to do what they did.” (I believe him because he’s always been straight with me before.) Trouble is, that doesn’t mean the war isn’t for AC-ME.
That’s my strong claim: that the war is on behalf of AC-ME. That could be true even if nobody in AC-ME wanted the war. And I think Chebri’s statements of motive make it clear that my strong claim is not far from the truth. It certainly isn’t a lie; at very worst, it’s possible I’ve misunderstood or misjudged Chebri’s motives. She denies that defending AC-ME was her exclusive motive, but it doesn’t need to be for me to be essentially correct.
My weaker, and earlier, claim (which I was never certain of, and don’t remember stating as a certainty, though I haven’t gone back and looked) is that AC-ME initiated the scheme to spin Chebri off and send her after me. To be honest, I don’t know for sure if they did or not. Whose idea was the war? Who suggested it? Cordus said he didn’t, and I believe him. Apparently Keselrat told you he didn’t, which is new information to me; I’ve never heard from him. But what about the other members of AC-ME, possibly including the ones who have been flying with Chebri? No data, and Cordus’s care in speaking only for himself rather reinforced my suspicions.
Given the circumstances, I don’t think my inferences behind the causes of this war have been demonstrated to be incorrect. I may have overestimated the level of AC-ME’s culpability, but nobody denies their enthusiastic support.
So, no, it would not “be a lie” for me to continue relying on the best information I have about the origins of this war. I don’t trust Chebri’s denials (she’s made it clear she doesn’t even know what a lie is) and nobody else who knows, is talking.
January 4th, 2008 at 9:22 am
I agree that we’re basically discussing semantics. Is the war FOR AC-ME’s benefit? Sure..but you could say that about every other corp that you can steal from in the region. Which is a stretch I know…I agree that Chebri’s actions are to the benefit of AC-ME. I just don’t agree that it was induced by AC-ME’s leadership team or AC-ME as a whole.
As in any organization who cannot wholly control the people underneath it. Chebri decided to protect a contingent of the people of her own accord. That same contingent endorses her action and supports it. When your war dec went out, a whole lot of other people got involved in some capacity in the initial days. Now it’s namely back to a Chebri/AC-ME war with occasional support from the alliance when they either ask for it…or one of our pew types wants to test a pvp fitting.
At the same time you did what you had to do in reality. Dec’ing just Chebri was just going to get you ganked by her AC-ME contingent supporters in a gang. I am in no way disagreeing that you basically had to dec AC-ME (and the alliance there forth). Right now since both sides are a minor nuisance to each other, the alliance is pretty much letting you guys play slap and tickle with each other. Bringing us all up there to camp you makes no sense. Besides there is such thing as TO MUCH togetherness time with your girlfriend. ;)
At the same time I don’t think Chebri/AC-ME can actually win this war. I mean your goal is basically to disrupt operations? How hard is that? A noob with a bit of cash who can war dec someone basically disrupts operations. So just by war dec’ing you cause a disruption of some type. Disruption is easy.
I don’t see an end to all this in the short term future. So you guys will probably continue to play cat-n-mouse for a while until AC-ME gets tired of it…gets Chebri to back off her war dec…and you declare victory. Que sera…
January 4th, 2008 at 9:39 am
Oh yeah…as to your “weak and earlier claim”:
“On average I was pulling one shipload of ore out of an AC-ME mining operation every other day or so. It would have been much cheaper for them to have accepted the status quo, rather than sending Chebri after me. This war is intended to help them understand that, and it should accomplish that goal even if I don’t have a single combat success. ”
It was the last paragraph in this blog article. Again…Chebri wasn’t sent to get you from what I can tell. But parts of AC-ME definitely supported her actions after they were made clear.
January 4th, 2008 at 10:05 am
At least as regards the present and future war situation, doesn’t look like we view things so very differently. Except maybe that part about too much togetherness time, heh.
January 4th, 2008 at 10:12 am
Funny….it’s just cause my wife is out of town. I’d be down “watching a movie” too. At least I hope that it’s your euphemism for getting it on…